Topic: Drug Effect Questionaire (DEQ) self-administered Nootropic Studies

The DEQ is a commonly used questionnaire used to determine subjective effects across a variety of substances. Some study has been done to show it's efficacy for use: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3624068/


Instead of using a line drawn, though, I'm going to use a number line from 1 - 10 for easier analysis, where 1 is "Not at all", and 10 is "Extremely".


PDF version: http://darknedgy.net/files/nootropic_trial.pdf


Questions:

NOT AT ALL [ 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 ] EXTREMELY
1.) Do you FEEL a drug effect right now?
2.) Are you HIGH right now?
3.) Do you DISLIKE any of the effects you are feeling right now?
4.) Do you LIKE any of the effects you are feeling right now?
5.) Would you like MORE of the drug, right now?


In addition to the "standard" DEQ-5, I'm also going to tack on additional metrics:


1.) Very briefly describe how you are feeling right now.


2.) List any additional drugs or supplements you have taken today.


3.) Did you eat before (or right after) ingestion?


If anyone starts on any nootropics or anything, feel free to fill this out daily as well. If you skip a day probably note that too. I don't have any nootropics to test that haven't been sitting around for a long time, so I'm gonna get some and we'll see how it goes. Note that it may be easier to print out a version of the form for tracking than logging into the forums and filling it out every day.


I purchased a bunch of Aniracetam so I'm gonna give that one a go, possibly add something onto it after a month or two if it doesn't do much.

Re: Drug Effect Questionaire (DEQ) self-administered Nootropic Studies

Will do. Already have a journal file on my pc which I intend to write to daily once I get started. Just waiting for my Noopept. Even stopped drinking/cannabis to decrease variables.

Hindsight is always 20/20.

God wrote:

A surprising amount of insight can be gleamed from sitting on the toilet. More concerning, however, is the amount of nostalgia. neutral



When in doubt, move north. God bless suomi.

Re: Drug Effect Questionaire (DEQ) self-administered Nootropic Studies

I think a major factor here is going to be consistency as sometimes it takes a while to work apparently. I was pretty bad about taking regular doses before which may explain why I got inconsistent results.

Re: Drug Effect Questionaire (DEQ) self-administered Nootropic Studies

I have no problems with concistency. Especially not if I note down every dose.

And after the TBI, I'm probably a most suitable comrade since the effects might be more accentuated for me. More realizeable.
Royal Mail needs 3-5 wörk days to get it to me. So, it might come on Thursday for all that I know. Which would be bad, I'd be at my grandparents at thursday...

It just occured to me, should I start right away? Or would it be cleaner to wait until next day specified time and take it then? Certainly gonna do an allergy check once it arrives though, aka a knifes tip.


Guess I'll have to check out what the initial dose of 10 mg does to me, how long it works should it do anything and then go consistent.


I'm not one of those luddies who blindly trys new drugs just to get rekted. I'm gonna do this as scientific as I can. And I'm gonna share my findings with you, because you are a magnificent band of faggots.

Hindsight is always 20/20.

God wrote:

A surprising amount of insight can be gleamed from sitting on the toilet. More concerning, however, is the amount of nostalgia. neutral



When in doubt, move north. God bless suomi.

Re: Drug Effect Questionaire (DEQ) self-administered Nootropic Studies

The DnE scientific archives thank you for your contribution.


I doubt it matters too much weather you wait the next day or not. Probably wouldn't take it too late in the day / towards nighttime as it might keep you awake though.

Re: Drug Effect Questionaire (DEQ) self-administered Nootropic Studies

I thought of it more as an consistency issue. It's less consistent if I take it once before actual start of this trial. However, allergy test must be made. They said they shipped today. It's on the journey :)

Hindsight is always 20/20.

God wrote:

A surprising amount of insight can be gleamed from sitting on the toilet. More concerning, however, is the amount of nostalgia. neutral



When in doubt, move north. God bless suomi.

Re: Drug Effect Questionaire (DEQ) self-administered Nootropic Studies

I updated the PDF so here's a better version:


http://darknedgy.net/files/nootropic_trial.pdf


I also just dosed some aniracetam at 3pm so I'll fill out a form in a bit. (750mg w/ ~800mg choline b)


First Report:

Drug name: Aniracetam.
Dosage: 750mg
Time of Administration: 3:00pm
Date: 1/7/2015
Time Now: 5:10pm


NOT AT ALL [ 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 ] EXTREMELY
1.) Do you FEEL a drug effect right now?
82.) Are you HIGH right now?63.) Do you DISLIKE any of the effects you are feeling right now?44.) Do you LIKE any of the effects you are feeling right now?55.) Would you like MORE of the drug, right now?41.) Very briefly describe how you are feeling right now.Earlier, I felt high. Now I feel really low. It feels like I'm on a .5mg k-pin. Earlier I felt almost jittery.2.) List any additional drugs or supplements you have taken today. ~800mg of choline bitartrate3.) Did you eat before (or right after) ingestion? I ate some bread and butter right after ingestion.


Second Report

Drug name: Aniracetam.
Dosage: 750mg
Time of Administration: 11:42pm
Date: 1/7/2015
Time Now: 3:12am


NOT AT ALL [ 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 ] EXTREMELY
1.) Do you FEEL a drug effect right now?
62.) Are you HIGH right now?43.) Do you DISLIKE any of the effects you are feeling right now?54.) Do you LIKE any of the effects you are feeling right now?55.) Would you like MORE of the drug, right now?21.) Very briefly describe how you are feeling right now.I felt a brief up feeling after ingestion which only lasted like 2 hours, then the down feeling again. Slight headache.2.) List any additional drugs or supplements you have taken today. ~800mg of choline bitartrate, caffeine.3.) Did you eat before (or right after) ingestion? Banana sandwich.

Re: Drug Effect Questionaire (DEQ) self-administered Nootropic Studies

Or, just check erorid.

https://www.erowid.org/smarts/

Decent reports on most of the known nootropics.

Re: Drug Effect Questionaire (DEQ) self-administered Nootropic Studies

That's really  not the point of this thread. Everyone knows about erowid and I've read reports ranging from "oh my GOD I'm Einstein and just discovered a new branch of PHYSICS because I took piracetam" to "it didn't do anything". This thread is a measurement of efficacy over time based on a fairly standard metric. If I wanted to read more user reports I would, but that doesn't have anything to do with how it specifically effects me. I've been reading user reports about smart drugs since I started taking them at 17 years old and they don't help for shit. Actual scientific studies are more useful, but the actual science is out for most of these drugs. Further, they appear to have a range of different effects from person to person, whereas individual drugs don't really effect individuals the same way at the same dosages, or at all. If everyone conformed to a single metric (like the PDF proposed here), we could do better statistical analysis and determine which are most likely to be effective. Since that's not happening, I'm just doing it for myself to see which appear to be effective for me.


This sidesteps subjectively trying to write shit down and make a determination based on that.

Re: Drug Effect Questionaire (DEQ) self-administered Nootropic Studies

http://i.imgur.com/egyUgZu.png

11 (edited by SaintVicious 2016-01-08 12:20:17)

Re: Drug Effect Questionaire (DEQ) self-administered Nootropic Studies

Hey duelix! You might have missed it but, we have a COMPREHENSIVE posting guide, JUST FOR YOU!
https://forums.darknedgy.net/viewtopic.php?id=5736
Kindly Refer to the OP in that thread.

Re: Drug Effect Questionaire (DEQ) self-administered Nootropic Studies

Erowid has no info on Noopept though. I really want to try it to see if it is more than chemically synthesized flour.
Also Phenylpiracetam seems interesting, there are suggestions of enhanced eye-body coordination in the anecdotes.

Hindsight is always 20/20.

God wrote:

A surprising amount of insight can be gleamed from sitting on the toilet. More concerning, however, is the amount of nostalgia. neutral



When in doubt, move north. God bless suomi.

Re: Drug Effect Questionaire (DEQ) self-administered Nootropic Studies

09.01.2016
The order has arrived. I have not done any drugs besides nicotine (which I used yesterday for learning) in the last week. It arrived in a small parcell, a cardboard box. There was no indication on what could be inside, except for the return address to JGSupplements. 
It is a white powder in a silver ziplock bag. Batch 7007, expires 16.02.2017. 
Similar to description here:
https://www.reddit.com/r/Nootropics/wiki/verification#wiki_noopept
It is 19:42 and I just took a ~10 mg scoop. Just took a scoop out and placed the scoup under my tounge until it desintergrated. It tastes bitter, but not unhandleable. Going to fill out absents drug survey. 
Drug Name: Noopept
Dosage: about 10 mg
Date: see above
Time of Administration: 19:42
1.) Do you feel a drug effect right now? 7
2.) Are you high right now? 0
3.) Do you dislike any of the effects you are feeling right now? 0
4.) Do you like any of the effects you are feeling right now? 10
5.) Would you like more of the drug right now? 0
Very briefly describe how you are feeling right now, and what time is it now?
It is evening. I feel slightly less annoyed. More concentrated, not more motivated, but less unmotivated. Hard to describe.
List any additional drugs or supplements you have taken today.
None.
Did you eat before (or right after) ingesting the drug?
I had dinner some time ago. 

A side effect, maybe from the bitterness, is dry mouth. Time to get something to drink. Update will come later. 
Hindsight is always 20/20.

God wrote:

A surprising amount of insight can be gleamed from sitting on the toilet. More concerning, however, is the amount of nostalgia. neutral



When in doubt, move north. God bless suomi.

Re: Drug Effect Questionaire (DEQ) self-administered Nootropic Studies

I am always a bit leery of stuff when it comes out. More power to yall. The anarchist in me believes such a compound, if known, would be suppressed even if it was not dangerous.

Still, a "Limitless" type compound even if it is only a 10 percent increase would raise eyebrows. But, you get into the trap where you have to continue to take this to get the effect. The same downpoint other drugs have.

Remember, though, proper rest and exercise can do a lot of the same things. It's just not as easy and more time consuming than popping stuff.

Re: Drug Effect Questionaire (DEQ) self-administered Nootropic Studies

I do excersice regularly (Just did today as a matter of fact, it's 30 minutes and keeps the body in shape) and I try to sleep enough, though that sometimes just doesn't work out.

According to our friendly Russian pharmacist company and Reddit, you don't get dependancy on Noopept. Kind of makes sense since it doesn't give you a high, afaik it doesn't even cause dopamine/serotonine release - I have to look into that.


It's been on the market in Russia for some time now...but I don't know russian so I can't search the Russian web for information or anecdotes. I certainly feel different after taking it - this stuff acts pretty fast.
Also seems to reduce anxiety. I like it.

Hindsight is always 20/20.

God wrote:

A surprising amount of insight can be gleamed from sitting on the toilet. More concerning, however, is the amount of nostalgia. neutral



When in doubt, move north. God bless suomi.

Re: Drug Effect Questionaire (DEQ) self-administered Nootropic Studies

Check blue light for experiences, pretty sure they have some. Know that this might not be indicative of how it will affect you.

Re: Drug Effect Questionaire (DEQ) self-administered Nootropic Studies

sloth wrote:

I do excersice regularly (Just did today as a matter of fact, it's 30 minutes and keeps the body in shape) and I try to sleep enough, though that sometimes just doesn't work out.

According to our friendly Russian pharmacist company and Reddit, you don't get dependancy on Noopept. Kind of makes sense since it doesn't give you a high, afaik it doesn't even cause dopamine/serotonine release - I have to look into that.


It's been on the market in Russia for some time now...but I don't know russian so I can't search the Russian web for information or anecdotes. I certainly feel different after taking it - this stuff acts pretty fast.
Also seems to reduce anxiety. I like it.

No physical addiction, true. But, if you stop you stop getting the increased cognition.

Much of the reading I have done on other nootropics, you had to have a continued dosage over a week or three to see effects. If it is immediate and not placebo, it may be something worth looking into.

I do remember in my times of working in the French Quarter as a professional waiter there were a few guys that swore by these "amino acid brain shakes" they concocted out of stuff at GNC foe a hefty price. They claim it took the edge off of hangovers from partying with tips or smoking the good pot. They claimed it made them able to concentrate on a busy section with 6 tables and a ton of orders during dinner rush. Not sure what was in it. Felt a slight energy boost which was nice. But, I was not hyper aware or anything.

To my knowledge, though, I do not think they made it a regular part of their lives so I guess it was not the ultra high brain performance solution in the long run for them, either.

Not to say this is the same. I just sit back and reserve judgment.

The problem is the only usual in depth discussion is reddit and the people that sell the stuff or are in league with those that sell it. Not that it automatically makes them wrong.

Re: Drug Effect Questionaire (DEQ) self-administered Nootropic Studies

True. I don't think this is placebo though. I'll see what my brother has to say tomorrow, he just took a scoop.

I'll see what happens when I take it after waking up tomorrow morning. But most effects I've noticed so far seem positive.


On the one hand I want to megadose once, to see if all that enhanced color/music shit is true. On the other, I don't want to waste it.

Hindsight is always 20/20.

God wrote:

A surprising amount of insight can be gleamed from sitting on the toilet. More concerning, however, is the amount of nostalgia. neutral



When in doubt, move north. God bless suomi.

Re: Drug Effect Questionaire (DEQ) self-administered Nootropic Studies

The difference between this and placebo is that racetam oriented  drugs have placebo controlled studies showing improved cognition. You might not even notice improved cognition and it could still be there. I definitely thought I felt something but placebo is pretty powerful so I'm not gonna rule that out, but even if it's a placebo well fuck it I'll take it because I feel better... There's like one reputable drug trial that showed significant gain for rehabilitation of cerebral trauma. That might not carry over to healthy people, but it's still something. Besides, sloth experienced head trauma...

Re: Drug Effect Questionaire (DEQ) self-administered Nootropic Studies

Drug Names: Oxiracetam and Aniracetam
Dosages: 750mg of each + 400mg of CDP Choline
Time of Administration: 3:20pm
Time Now: 5:25pm
Date: 1/17/2016

NOT AT ALL [ 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 ] EXTREMELY
1.) Do you FEEL a drug effect right now?: 4
2.) Are you HIGH right now?:1
3.) Do you DISLIKE any of the effects you are feeling right now?:3
4.) Do you LIKE any of the effects you are feeling right now?: 5
5.) Would you like MORE of the drug, right now?: 1


1.) How I feel: Very weird. All of my muscles feel relaxed. I felt very tired after ingestion and fell asleep almost immediately when I laid down. My head is kind of clear, it's really hard to explain the sensation. Very relaxed, I want to sleep more. Like muscle relaxers or something?
2.) Additional Shit: Not except for what's listed above.
3.) Did I eat, yes, orange, some toquitos and shit.

Re: Drug Effect Questionaire (DEQ) self-administered Nootropic Studies

durgs r bad mkay and i f u do them ur bad
stay in drugs kids, dont do school !!

Maybe I should try this shit to help me do shit.

sloth wrote:

Comfy does not provide challenge, challenge provides success, success provides happiness. Our world is not comfy, although we tried to make it so. Slaves of our own inventions, yada, yada. Not only on a technological level, also on a social and political level. Nothing more but apes. Apes with psychosomatic disorders.

Re: Drug Effect Questionaire (DEQ) self-administered Nootropic Studies

Drug Names: Oxiracetam and Aniracetam
Dosages: 375mg of each + 400mg of CDP Choline
Time of Administration: 8:00am
Time Now: 10:55am
Date: 1/21/2016

NOT AT ALL [ 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 ] EXTREMELY
1.) Do you FEEL a drug effect right now?: 7
2.) Are you HIGH right now?:5
3.) Do you DISLIKE any of the effects you are feeling right now?:1
4.) Do you LIKE any of the effects you are feeling right now?: 7
5.) Would you like MORE of the drug, right now?: 6


1.) How I feel: Basically normal, slight mild amphetamine like feeling, but only in my head. Not anxious at all. This is very atypical, especially since I slept very little. 5 hours or so. Wasn't anxious about looking dumb in class at all, even answered questions. Felt great, even when I got shit wrong it wasn't too embarrassing.

2.) Additional Shit: 100mg caffeine but that's normal, feel different than usual on it.
3.) Did I eat, no.